I am having an investment casting tool built for u bolts for my 1910 Stanley. If anyone is interested in purchasing any of these please PM me.We are casting them from 4130 steel. I am currently waiting for the pilot run for part approval. Pricing will depend upon the size of my order.
On a similar note, I have a few broken springs. Does anyone have a source for making new springs?
Paul

Hi Paul,

I think I would be a bit wary of casting the U bolts - they are very thin in cross section and I would think you would risk cracks in the corners. I think the originals were forged - I milled mine from solid bar which took a while but at least I know the steel is good throughout.

For springs, I searched high and low for an old style auto spring maker without success. Then I hit on the idea of the springs they make for horse drawn wagons. These are elliptical and made in varying widths. I got mine from Texas Wagon Works - they needed a lot of work to make them right as the leaves were the wrong length and the taper was too short but they were a good start. Also they are only supplied with a bolt and thick washers to join the two halves so I had to make the proper shaped bolts. It took about a month of weekends and evenings to cut and grind all of them to shape. You may also want to keep an eye on Ebay but look under wagon springs rather than car springs.

I think there are a couple of Amish spring makers that could make them for you but I had no luck in trying to contact them.

Hope this helps

Jeff

Dear Jeff
Investment castings have come a long way in the industry. I see no problem in high quality parts. 4130 has a tensile strength of 97200 Lb with a yield of 63100 Lb
I would have no problem with cast U bolts made this way.
You would still have to do a setup for the threads if you wanted the tolerance.
[www.ruger.com]

[www.ruger.com]

I made my spindles and yokes for my front end from A-148 structural steel castings 110,000 Lb tensile
[www.stanleysteamers.com]
[www.stanleysteamers.com]

I used an investment casting process to make my little universals for my cylinder blow down valve. Nice detail.
[www.stanleysteamers.com]


Rolly

The late Stuart Herrmann use to make Model R springs from scratch. He would water jet cut the leafs from 0.250 annelid spring steel stock. Then mill or grinned the taper on each end and clean up all the edges, next he rolled them to the required radius, he had templates for each leaf.
Then they would all go out to the heat shop to be tempered and drawn.
He would assemble them and heat the tab to be bent over. The first ones he made did not have the bent tabs.

I am not sure if his son Mark is going to carry on this work. Look him up he is in Connecticut
Rolly



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/25/2013 05:27PM by Rolly.

I stand corrected Rolly - you mean I didn't have to spend 2 months in front of my milling machine!

Jeff

Jeff
There’s a cost factor involved.
I water jet cut mine from plate then machined them to finish, but for the model EX there is not as much detail as the latter cars. And you only need 16.
[www.stanleysteamers.com]


To get quality detail with the investment casting you need a very good mold to cast the wax parts. Also you have to have a foundry that works with the higher metals.
If you use an exiting part, you won’t have the same thing because of the shrinkage.

To do it correctly you need to start from scratch with a new pattern.
Of course today you can draw the part in 3-D to the correct over size for shrinkage and print the mold on a 3-D printer. But this cost money. Then you need the foundry that does the wax and makes the tree.

The universals I made, I made the pattern, and I had a shop make the mold from my pattern, they also did the wax injection and also make the tree, but they had to bring the tree and ceramic mold to a foundry to get it purred. Some one they work with.

I don’t know what the cost is to have someone else to the whole thing. I do some 3-D drawings but I’m not there yet.

I found a 3-D drawing I did of my U-bolt but I never considered using it to do investment castings.

Rolly



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/25/2013 09:38PM by Rolly.

Heres some pics of doing it the hard way!

Jeff

Rolly,
I had my son draw a print in solidworks. The attached pdf can be rotated with the correct Adobe viewer. The casting source is building a tool to the print including correcting for shrink when the wax forms are poured. We added an .060 Radius at the 2 inside corners to get rid of the sharp points on the originals.
The owner of the shop is 75 years old and was excited to do the job. He gave me a tour of his operation and it was very impressive. The attachment of the wax forms to the tree was truely an art form.
I have a die and holder that will allow me to thread the ends using a bridgeport. I am anxious to see the approval parts of this tool.
Paul

Jeff,
I am only 2 hours from Indiana Amish country, Sound like a road trip is in order. It probably be wiser to make all new springs rather than replace any broken leafs.
Paul

Jeff,
Nice mill work. I am afraid I don't have the patience or the skill to do that kind on work on my bridgeport.
Paul

I am amassed at the difference between parts used on the difference models, but I guess I shouldn’t be. There still doing it today.

Jeff’s car is going to be a showpiece.

Paul it looks like you’re on the right tract. I used a universal bit looks like a hollow end mill in my Bridgeport to machine the ends of my U bolt’s for threading then threaded them in the lathe.
See attachments.
Good luck on your project.
Rolly

I have already made U bolts from 4140 for 10,20 and 30 hp Stanleys and after two years of testing have a custom manufacturer of springs using .291 steel. Other thicknesses are available and both tongue and groove and tabs are available.. Allen

Finally got the castings back and got them threaded. A bit of work getting them threaded, but at least I got them off the list.
Paul

Good looking U-bolt. :)