Hi I now own the 740 roadster that was advertised on this website. The car is a terrific acquisition but needs some TLC so I have a number of queries, any help gratefully received.

The drive gear and cable from the speedo drive gear are missing. Is there any drawings, pictures or a units second hand or recreations available?

The wiring is all braided cable with an external wire armour wrap. My mentor in the UK, Mark Drake who has a beautifully restored 740 roadster has not seen this type of wire. Possibly factory briefly or from a later restoration? The electricians tape over some of the splices is definitely "modern".

There is a small fitting over the pump pit that looks a bit like the dashboard lamps. Is this a factory fitting or maybe an aftermarket light?

The lining of the burner is a stainless steel sheet with a light weight mortar approximately one inch thick behind it. The mortar it is broken up in quite a few places. Any suggestions of what should be used to replace it?

One last question. The pumps have bronze balls in the check valves. The need replacing as they are no longer spherical so that is underway. Just curious to know if bronze check balls were a factory thing?

Thanks Mark

Hi Mark,

My, what seems to be very original, 740 chassis has a lot of the wire cladding on the wiring. Not the best picture but this shows some large and small looms with metal over wires.

Also for the lights, my pump pit has a bulb mounted off the frame for light as well as near the pilot. All seems like it should be there.

I have most of the Speedo drive parts, but no pictures at the moment. I can try to get some soon. Take care!

Jared

The speedometer drive gears are available on eBay from time to time. The driving gear's tooth count is two times the diameter of the wheel in inches. 36" diameter x 2 equals 72 teeth count. The pump pit had a courtesy light as described. Metal clad wiring was the Stanley standard for the day. I use a Ramcote 1200 for the filler behind the stainless steel burner liner. Bronze balls were the standard balls used in the power pumps. Stainless ball bearings are today's replacement.

If you need to re-wire you can get the correct stuff from Rhode Island Wiring Service Inc 401 789 1955
[www.riwire.com]

I rewired my 1920 with there wire. Same as the original.

Rolly

Thanks everyone. Really great information. The wiring in my car and the light fitting are the same as Jarreds. Thanks Rolly for the heads up on the wire source, the riwire catalogue armoured cable is a perfect match.
I was unclear re the speedo in that I have the driving gear for the speedo on the rh front wheel it's the driven gear and holder that is missing. I'm off to count teeth.
Thanks once again great information.
Cheers
Mark

Mark
I have two names of guys I met at Hershey, one told me he had lots of parts to hold the gears on the front axle and could match any speedometer with the right gears and hardware. I can’t remember which one.
Bill’s Speedometer shop Sidney OH 45365 937-492-7800
The other one is
Bob’s speedometer Howell Michigan 48843 1-800-592-9673
Good luck
Rolly

I was re-reading the Tale of two Dobles by Barry Herbert for the third time.
It seems every time I re-read a book I learn something new.
He used a GPS speedometer in one of them. I didn’t even know they made them.
I went on line and looked them up and you can get all kinds in any size. Nice stuff.
Most just need 12V DC they also make them for Motorcycles.
Rolly



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2014 02:02PM by Rolly.

Since you already have the drive gear, then you now need the "Stewart Speedometer Knuckle". There are several for sale on eBay right now. The mounting hardware and the speedometer cable are also available on eBay. If you buy from the speedometer shops that Rolly suggested above, you are more sure to get the correct parts that will fit and work properly.

Hi More questions. I've dropped the burner to turn it round to the correct position. I've discovered the inner liner is badly fitted so I've removed it and the insulating refractory behind it is crumbling and very uneven covering in some areas quite a large amount of the slots in the burner plate. So I've gone ahead and removed the refractory. The outer casing that is now fully exposed has been cut in a few places and has also rusted losing a lot of the top section. There is a gap between the burner plate (which appears in really good condition) and the outer casing of about a 0.5 inch which the refractory previously filled. I can just put a new inner liner and refractory back in place, but I'm debating making a complete new stainless steel burner pan with venturi tubes and supports. I can use the existing one as a pattern but any hints tips or declarations, even if only to say I must be mad, gratefully received. :-)

Mark
I normally make my pans from 16 gage 316 SS only because I can no longer tig weld the edged nicely using thinner material. My friend 85 can still take a knife and cut the side of a coke can and then weld it back up. 18 or 20 gage 0.0359 is fine if you can weld or do a sheet metal joint. The bottom is really an oval disk.
I make a plywood disk with a series of holes around the edges so as to clamp it together to weld the bottom on keeping it round and the top edge flat with the table.
If you need to do a lay out its kind of easy, I always do a layout as some burners are deeper then others. On the inside liner only use 310 combustion grade SS
Rolly



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/23/2014 01:30PM by Rolly.

Stainless is the way to go. It will take the heat. In the past, I went to great efforts to recycle the old rusted out burner pans, only to have them fail within the next year due to burning through and their rusting out again. It really ruins a nice vacation to be fighting mixing tube fires because the burner pan had developed new fire leaks. Do it right the first time, then you won't have any worries from a patched up burner pan. Above, Rolly has some good shop procedures in building a new burner pan.

Thanks all for the encouragement and Rolly especially for the material specs and drawings. I can make the patterns etc but I'll have the sheet metal welded by a local TIG chap who has "the gift". I can stick heavy stainless together with arc rods but fine neat work is not my forte.
I'll put some more pictures up as I strip the burner down.

Thanks once again
Mark

A source that I have used for speedometer parts and service is Russ Furstnow in Flagstaff AZ. His phone number is 928 526 1343.
I have had speedometers service by himand purchased speedometer gears, both drive and driven gears. He usually has a few Speedometer swivels (knockles) on hand too. I think he makes up speedometer cables too, but I am not sure on that. He also produced and sells a book "The Antique Automobile Speedometer" that has a lot of information like the gear types and sizes appropriate for various speedometer heads vs tire size.
Hope this helps.

The progress the last little while has been a series of backward steps. The white woven bandage type insulation seems to corrode everything it touches. The board insulation is OK (picture)and was two thirds the way up the boiler with one layer of the bandage over the top, above this was 3 layers of the bandage (Picture) which appears to be water set. However it got damp, and having a steam whistle right by the boiler probably didn't help, it has corroded the wire winding lightly mostly but there is a couple of bad areas.
I'm currently pulling out the condenser (boy that's a heavy piece of kit) so I can inspect more of the boiler wire in the top third. Could be up for a rewind.
The burner and plenum is out of the burner pan and is OK just rusty.
Is there any demon coating someone has tried to keep the rust at bay?
One more question, the bolts that hold the bonnet (hood) to the confessor shell and the condenser wheel to the confessor bottom tank are all a fine thread but an assortment of heads on the roadster. There are a couple with a thin head and a cross slot. Is that the original and what sort of washer should be behind? I take it galvanised is probably not original. :-) As usual any help gratefully received
Cheers
Mark

Mark
The insulation and covering looks to be the correct material. Ceramic fiber insulation Fiberfrax made by Unifrax Corp. The cloth coving is called a finishing cloth with water based adhesive like wallpaper past. There are several brands on the market. It should be painted after installed.

It sounds like the boiler should be striped of the wire wrapping and the shell inspected both inside and out. The first thing I think I would do is a hydro test of 150 % or 900 psi.
Every boiler should be tested to 125 % of operating pressure each year. Also hydro your safety valve and make sure it lifts at 750 psi.
To inspect the inside for calcium build up and excessive pitting around the water line you can get nice little cameras with the head around ¼ inch and 36 inch probe. Around $350.00

Rolly

I got one of these cheap camera's to see how well it worked. It's actually pretty darn good for the $42 price! 6mm head on it, usb to a computer. Pretty happy, especially for the price.

[www.amazon.com]

Just to clarify
This is the photo I should have put up to show the effect of the finishing cloth used directly against steel and the effect of the setting agent if it contacts steel. Bottom 2 thirds of the boiler is OK as it had the heavy board against it. The top third had just water set bandage (finishing cloth) this has attacked the wire winding and where the setting agent ran down behind the insulation board appears to have caused quite bad corrosion. The finding cloth was also applied directly to the outer skin of the smoke hood and the outer shin of the boiler pan. Again it did them no favours.

Cheers
Mark

Mark
Now you have first hand knowledge of the improper use of material. Finishing cloth goes on over insulation. It’s a protective layer to keep the insulation from breaking up. It’s not a waterproof layer, you need to paint it. Also you only have to wet it enough to activate the adhesive. It should look more like white wood glue, not running all over the place.
Rolly