1 Steam Cars : Phorum
General Steam Car topics
Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Barton Buhtz (IP Logged)
Date: August 22, 2004 12:45PM
<HTML>Back in the early 1960s I was attending college in San Francisco. My wife and I would take walks down near the Cliff house. In one of the little shops there we discovered a Stanley Steamer Motorcycle. Then one day it was gone as well as the shop. Recently I have been in discussion with Byron Matson, Curator (soon to retire) at San Sylmar the museum owned by Merle Norman Cosmetics. He had hoped to be back in Hershey this past year, but was unable to do so. He was going to see if they knew the whereabouts of that Stanley Steamer Motorcycle that was there in SF. Does anyone know whether it is still in existance and/or its whereabouts? If so, San Sylmar would like to discuss obtaining it for their museum. Every vehicle there from the late 1800s on has been completely restored and all are in perfect working condition. Looking forward to any positive response.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Jim Crank (IP Logged)
Date: August 22, 2004 01:36PM
<HTML>Barton,
Tell Byron to call me some morning.
The motorcycle you saw at the Cliff House Museum is not a Stanley. It was made by a Mr. Gillenwater in Sacramento, back in the 1920's.
I know who owns it and I assure you it is not for sale at any price.
It was restored to good running condition by David Sarlin and I have a half hour sound movie of us getting it running and riding it.
Cycle magazine and Live Steam both ran big stories about it.
JC</HTML>
Tell Byron to call me some morning.
The motorcycle you saw at the Cliff House Museum is not a Stanley. It was made by a Mr. Gillenwater in Sacramento, back in the 1920's.
I know who owns it and I assure you it is not for sale at any price.
It was restored to good running condition by David Sarlin and I have a half hour sound movie of us getting it running and riding it.
Cycle magazine and Live Steam both ran big stories about it.
JC</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: SSsssteamer (IP Logged)
Date: August 22, 2004 01:54PM
<HTML>I just recently visited the Fisherman's Warf Museum in San Francisco and there is a steam motor cycle on display that has used many Stanley parts to make it work. It looks professionally built because everything has a finished look, but it was built by a private party, possibly back about 1920. It sounds like the same steam motor cycle. Maybe Dick Vennerbeck knows more about this one. How about it Dick?</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Dick Vennerbeck (IP Logged)
Date: August 22, 2004 03:37PM
<HTML>Pat,
I just learned about the steam motorcylcle at Fisherman's Warf Museum a few weeks ago. I have not seen it but I suspect that it's the same one that Dave restored. My friendship with Dave began when was building the "Tule Princess" , long after he restored the motorcycle. When his father, Ray Sarlin, asked me to sell Dave's steam books (at the B and W Steamboat Meet) many years ago there was not any info on the motorcycle. I believe it was given to the owner. I do have a small collection of notes, photos and drawings of the "Vesuvious", Dave's steam bicycle.
I pick up my new 20" stanley boiler tomorrow! Thanks for your assistance.
Dick</HTML>
I just learned about the steam motorcylcle at Fisherman's Warf Museum a few weeks ago. I have not seen it but I suspect that it's the same one that Dave restored. My friendship with Dave began when was building the "Tule Princess" , long after he restored the motorcycle. When his father, Ray Sarlin, asked me to sell Dave's steam books (at the B and W Steamboat Meet) many years ago there was not any info on the motorcycle. I believe it was given to the owner. I do have a small collection of notes, photos and drawings of the "Vesuvious", Dave's steam bicycle.
I pick up my new 20" stanley boiler tomorrow! Thanks for your assistance.
Dick</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Barton Buhtz (IP Logged)
Date: September 08, 2004 11:49PM
<HTML>Thank you for the responses. From the respinses it appears that we may be referring to the same steam motor cycle, but I cannot be certain. The display sign that was on the cycle clearly identified it as a Stanley Steamer and that when it was originally built there was an offer of $500 to anyione who would ride it wide open for at least five minutes. Apparently no one every collected.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Ben in Maine (IP Logged)
Date: September 09, 2004 08:58AM
<HTML>At least 2 cycles were built at Watertown,,as pacing bikes,,,One was a Locomobile,,The other was a Stanley,,,,The front forks were different ,,The water tank offset the weight of the engine,,Photos of these are rare,,but I have seen pics of both,,,Cheers Ben</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Ben (IP Logged)
Date: September 09, 2004 01:15PM
<HTML>Sineage many times is dead wrong,,,,Good for selling paper and ? politics,,,Cheers Ben</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Harold Treacy (IP Logged)
Date: September 16, 2004 09:35AM
<HTML>I have some info - first I test my email sendout. HT</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Harold Treacy (IP Logged)
Date: September 16, 2004 09:43AM
<HTML>Being native San Franciscans, we (my mother and father and I) visited
the Dliff House frequently. The steam motorcycle exhibit was a part of
the museum downstairs and it did bear a placard about the reward
for a driver. It didn't look like a Stanley product to me. In earlier years
lots of steam-driven vehicles were just dubbed "Stanley" this or that.
In the 1950's I became acquanted with Phil Karp, First Base in the
San Francisco Sympony Orchestra. He lived out near Mt. Olympus and
kept his restored Stanley Steamer in his garage. There was another
Stanley Steamer in a house over on Portola Driive. Any of the San
Francisco steam buffs probably knew about that motorcycle.
The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
the Dliff House frequently. The steam motorcycle exhibit was a part of
the museum downstairs and it did bear a placard about the reward
for a driver. It didn't look like a Stanley product to me. In earlier years
lots of steam-driven vehicles were just dubbed "Stanley" this or that.
In the 1950's I became acquanted with Phil Karp, First Base in the
San Francisco Sympony Orchestra. He lived out near Mt. Olympus and
kept his restored Stanley Steamer in his garage. There was another
Stanley Steamer in a house over on Portola Driive. Any of the San
Francisco steam buffs probably knew about that motorcycle.
The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Harold Treacy (IP Logged)
Date: September 16, 2004 09:52AM
<HTML>No. 3: My feelings were that the Stanley steam engines were a lot of work to keep running and the Doble concept (with its flash-boiler) was easier to run and safer to operate. In the 1950s Bechtel Corp in Emeryville was experimenting with a multiple-wheel vehicle driven with little steam engines on each wheel from a central flash-point boiler. One of those might be keen for a motorcycle.
The notion of a motorcycle running fast with a firetube boiler on board
(or a watertube for that matter) is a little extreme - and the rider might need a helper running alongside passing over chunks of coal or firewood. I don't
think the Cliff House Museum model had propane tanks available at its
time. Oh I almost forgot: Acetylene generators! Just the thing. No wonder
they owners couldn't find a test operator!
Why not post some photos so we steam buffs might indentify the various comonents assembled into the Cliff House unit? There are probably enought steam buffs stilll living to help out. The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
The notion of a motorcycle running fast with a firetube boiler on board
(or a watertube for that matter) is a little extreme - and the rider might need a helper running alongside passing over chunks of coal or firewood. I don't
think the Cliff House Museum model had propane tanks available at its
time. Oh I almost forgot: Acetylene generators! Just the thing. No wonder
they owners couldn't find a test operator!
Why not post some photos so we steam buffs might indentify the various comonents assembled into the Cliff House unit? There are probably enought steam buffs stilll living to help out. The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Harold Treacy (IP Logged)
Date: September 16, 2004 10:05AM
<HTML>4. I wonder whether some of that Cliff House Museum stuff wasn't overflow from the Sutro Museum (occupying space in the Sutro Baths next door). So to find more about the Steam Motorcycle a look at records from Sutro could be profitable. There is a Sutro Libraray someplace nearby and a Sutro Collection someplace else. My friend in Dayton [Greg Melton (775) 882-6596] managed a large collection of Sutro memorabilia out here and he might remember whether any motorcycle stuff showed up.
Of course one might speculate that Sutro had the steam motorcycle built so as to attract investors - kind of like a tunnel he sold to stockholders (enabling him to buy most of the SF land where the Richmond District is today and sell the lots to early homebuilders).
Lucius Beebe once helped me to seach for steam cars in NW Nevada. He took me to visit places where persons had vehicles - they all seemed to be
older vehicles of the Stanley Steamer type of mechanism ald a lot of work to keep running.
Now a new Harley with a plutonium reactor to generate steam might be just the thing for today's highways! Again, we might have trouble finding a volunteer to test it.... The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
Of course one might speculate that Sutro had the steam motorcycle built so as to attract investors - kind of like a tunnel he sold to stockholders (enabling him to buy most of the SF land where the Richmond District is today and sell the lots to early homebuilders).
Lucius Beebe once helped me to seach for steam cars in NW Nevada. He took me to visit places where persons had vehicles - they all seemed to be
older vehicles of the Stanley Steamer type of mechanism ald a lot of work to keep running.
Now a new Harley with a plutonium reactor to generate steam might be just the thing for today's highways! Again, we might have trouble finding a volunteer to test it.... The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Harold Treacy (IP Logged)
Date: September 16, 2004 10:30AM
<HTML>5. By the way (this is slightly off point) we in Dayton, Lyon County, Nevada, would appreciate any information from collector about the whereabouts of our town's first fire-pumper --- it would up in a private car museum around Hollywood back in the fifies (approx. date) and afterwards was sold at a Southeby's Auction. Any suggestions as to how I might search for it?
The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
The Professor in Dayton.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Barton Buhtz (IP Logged)
Date: September 18, 2004 12:55PM
<HTML>Unfortunately we have no pictures of the steam motorcycle in SF. Much of the collection from the Cliff House and Sutro was purchawed by a vendor in Santa Fe Springs, California. Some of that was purchased by the Nethercutt in Sylmar where it still is today. I knew Byron Matson who was the Curator there for 31 years (He retired last week) and he said that there was no steam motorcycle in the inventory he saw. There are a couple of old steam boiler restored fire vehicles in the Nethercutt collection. Contact Arnold Schmidt at (818) 364-6464. He is in charge of restoration at the Nethercutt and might be helpful regarding the unit you are seeking. Thank you for the information on the motorcycle. I will keep looking.</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: Mark Stacey (IP Logged)
Date: October 16, 2004 08:53PM
<HTML>Barton please re read Jim Crank's message . He has given you the facts not speculation.
There is an article in Live Steam Magazine May 1981 pages 10 to 15 with the full history pictures of the motorcycle, boiler , burner, flow paths and engine. The front cover has a large colour picture of the motorcycle
Appologies for not backing up Jim's message earlier, I have only just unearthed the relevent copy. It was in the attic requiring a nervous ladder trip through a man hole, I swear I'd never put any steam stuff up there. Must have been the cats.
Cheers
Mark Stacey
www.cncprototyping.co.nz</HTML>
There is an article in Live Steam Magazine May 1981 pages 10 to 15 with the full history pictures of the motorcycle, boiler , burner, flow paths and engine. The front cover has a large colour picture of the motorcycle
Appologies for not backing up Jim's message earlier, I have only just unearthed the relevent copy. It was in the attic requiring a nervous ladder trip through a man hole, I swear I'd never put any steam stuff up there. Must have been the cats.
Cheers
Mark Stacey
www.cncprototyping.co.nz</HTML>
Re: Stanley Steamer Motorcycle
Posted by: garrett (IP Logged)
Date: October 28, 2004 06:06PM
<HTML>hi</HTML>
Re: trying to reach Byron Matson
Posted by: Bob MacDonald (IP Logged)
Date: November 08, 2005 07:44PM
<HTML>I am an old high school friend of Byron's. We used to spend our time restoring his model T. He moved away and so did I. Does anyone know how I can reach him? Now that we are both retired maybe we can start another project together.
Thanks in advance for your help.
With best regards
Bob</HTML>
Thanks in advance for your help.
With best regards
Bob</HTML>
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